Lisa Murkowski

What does pragmatic climate policy look like today? In this special episode, our Michael Greenstone sits down with Senator Lisa Murkowski (R-Alaska) and former Senator Heidi Heitkamp (D-North Dakota) for a frank conversation about regulation, the energy transition, and the politics of bipartisan climate action. The two senators don’t always agree—but they share a belief that durable change starts with listening. Shocked is part of the University of Chicago Podcast Network and produced by Magnificent Noise for the Institute for Climate and Sustainable Growth, which combines a 360-degree approach to education with frontier research having an impact in front-line communities globally. The Institute’s efforts are driven by the need to balance climate risks with societal growth. To follow or support their work, see our show notes or visit climate.uchicago.edu Amy Harder is the host, along with co-host, Michael Greenstone, a professor at the University of Chicago and director of the Institute for Climate and Sustainable Growth. Our executive producers are Eric Nuzum, Michael Greenstone, and Sam Ori. Our production staff includes Christine Driscoll, Amy Pedulla, Sophie Bridges, Jamie York, and Samantha Henig. Our sound designer is Kristen Mueller. Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

First, in rare joint interview, Jake speaks with key Senators Joe Manchin and Lisa Murkowski about how to work together in a deeply divided Congress. The three discuss if bipartisanship is still possible in today’s Washington, their progress toward reforming the Electoral Count Act, and what’s next for President Biden's agenda on Capitol Hill. Next, as the Winter Olympics begin with a controversial start in Beijing, Jake speaks with US Ambassador to the United Nations Linda Thomas-Greenfield. She says China is using the Olympics to try to distract from its human rights abuses against Uyghurs. She also discusses whether China is drawing any lessons from the United States’ response to Russian aggression against Ukraine. Finally, Jake reflects on the last time the world looked the other way on an Olympic host country’s human rights abuses, with the story of Jewish German fencer Helena Mayer and the 1936 Berlin Olympics. To learn more about how CNN protects listener privacy, visit cnn.com/privacy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices